I remember making the claim last year after the US Open that Djoko was going to surpass Roger and not only take over the No. 1 ranking but also eclipse Roger's Grand Slam titles number. I still stand by those predictions although I do recall that many of you out there, including Mr. Know it All, DMan1, said that that was preposterous and Djoko was still a long way off. Well, the guy's won the only major so far this year and two Masters titles already on two different surfaces. Roger did beat him a couple of weeks ago in Monte Carlo, if anyone's going to knock off Nadal in Paris or is the favorite at Wimbledon and the US Open, I think it's Nadal.

 The guy might retire in the middle of matches, he might be obnoxious, as are his parents and bros, but he is an uncanny competitor and I would not be surprised to see him already have three Grand Slams under his belt by the end of 2008 and Roger is going to have to fight like a dog to eclipse Sampras' 14. Has everyone seen enough--losing to Fish in straight sets in IW, to Stepanek in straights in Rome, to Roddick in Miami and to Nadal in Monte Carlo with a 4-0 lead in the 2nd set--to believe that Roger isn't either the ole Roger anymore or he's finally starting to face stiff competition and he's feeling the pressure. I think Roger will still win a Slam or two more, but he'll be more like Becker who won I think only one Slam after 26, then Agassi who won like 5.
 

Redhead:

   Have you been drinking the gatorade from Scoop's water bottle? I will absolutely concur with you and Scoop: barring injury, Djoker will be the next #1. But I still don't agree with you when you say he will "eclipse Roger's Grand Slam titles number."

   Roger is not done winning majors yet. He's still only 26 and he's got the two majors where he's been most successful - Wimbledon and US Open - coming up.

   Are you saying Roger won't break Pete's record? I would take that bet. Yes, he isn't the same old Roger, but remember: the illness he had knocked Ancic out nearly half the season last year. It's not like he had a cold (and I know, I know once we bring up the mono people crawl out of the woodwork saying "he's not really sick", "it's an alibi", "he's afraid of facing Spadea's backhand so he went down on purpose..." "XXX is pregnant with DMan1's love child...." :) you get the idea.

   Djoker has clearly had a better year than both Fed and Nadal and DJoker is clearly on the ascent and he will be #1 eventually - agree with you completely on all counts there. But when you say "he is an uncanny competitor..." Was he an uncanny and great competitor when he bailed out and retired vs. Nadal in the 2006 Roland Garros quarters? Was he an uncanny competitor when he bailed out and retired vs. Nadal in the '07 Wimbledon semis? Was he an uncanny competitor when he bailed out of the Monte Carlo semis vs. Federer citing breathing problems? Was he an uncanny competitor when he pulled one of the biggest gamesmanship moves I've seen at the Open in basically stopping play for 20 minutes vs. Monfils at the 05 Open? Was he an uncanny competitor when he walked off the court in Moscow during Davis Cup in February? Was he an uncanny competitor when he mailed in the final 2 tournaments losing 5 straight matches at the end of last year - including Shanghai - and basically looking not all that interested in competing?

   I was talking to Scoop earlier and said remember when Scottie Pippen, playing for the Bulls, begged off the final few seconds of that playoff game vs. Knicks because Jackson called Toni Kukoc's numnber and not Pippens? Pippen was crucified for that yet Djoker has retired from more big tournaments then Fed and Nadal combined and I'm constantly being told what a great competitor he is?

  We seem to have short memories in tennis.

 I have nothing against Djoker - he is a personality ("if you wanna call it personality..." Sampras said before the MSG match vs. Fed) and I think he's great for tennis because he's so different -stylistically and personality wise - from Fed and Nadal and because it is a lot more interesting with three guys vying for the top than just two.

And you were right then in predicting Djoker's ascent and you are right now: the guy is one hell of a player who is only getting better and better and he will be #1 and he will be a multiple Grand Slam champion. Agree with you completely: you called it and were right.

  And tennis history tells us many players who were not mature competitors when they were 20 (see Agassi, see Lendl, see Justine Henin, see Rios - wait a minute did Rios ever mature?) can mature into great competitors so I'm not saying his recent history is indicative of his future career - quite the opposite I think the guy is smart enough to know he can't continue to quit without facing repercussions - particularly when he gets to #1. It would be a travesty for the sport to have a #1 who does not finish major matches.

   But can people please spare me the "great competitor..." line until he actually becomes a great competitor?

   When he stops bailing out every time he has the sniffles then yes we can call him a great competitor. When he has to win with the pressure of being the defending champion or top seed or World #1 then yeah we can call him a great competitor. For now, I call him a tremendous talent and great player but great competitor? Does a great competitor treat two of the most important tournaments in the world like they're challengers by bailing out?  You tell me.

 

Redhead you mention all of Djoker's bailouts.  How can anyone even suggest comparing Djoker to Roger????? 

 How many CONSECUTIVE FINALS did Roger win?????  If someone has that list I would adore seeing  it added into this thread.

Djoker's personality and previous history will not allow him to begin to think like the champion that Roger Federer has already proven himself to be.  And that's where it all starts, so we who respect Roger and Nadal have little to worry about when guys like the joker come along.  Even if he starts to win some titles it will not be in the same style and fashion of the joker.  I cannot even imagine any other professional male tennis player imitating a female preshot routine on national TV.  I doubt he will ever have a solid fan base and I don't think we should assume he will rise to the #1 ranking. 

I agree with a lot of what RP has said. Djokovic will get to the number one ranking if not by the end of this year then soon after, but Federer ain't done yet. He showed me in Monte Carlo that when he's on, he has too much class for Djokovic and Novak wasn't even decent enough to accept defeat and give Federer a fair win. Federer is winning less and it looks like his dominance is waning, but no one can be sure if this is just a temporary slump because of mono and a confidence drop or because Novak is beginning a takeover of the top spot. Even if we assume that Roger is done winning grand slams or only has one or two more left as you said, that means Novak will have to win more than 12 slams and THAT TAKES A LOT!!!!  You're basically saying  that Novak will be the greatest player the game's ever seen. How can you possibly make a claim like that based on a single grand slam title and his play over 18 months? Djoko's fitness needs serious improvement; after winning Indian Wells and Montreal, he bombed out early the next week in Miami and Cincy. It wouldn't surprise me if the same thing were to happen this week in Hamburg, but he got two retirements in Rome and didn't have to face a seeded player throughout the event so he should be rested.

I call Djoko an "uncanny competitor," not a "great competitor," and there's a difference. Djoko does not let defeats get him down and he also tries not to let his opponent feel like he has the upper hand on him, albeit by defaulting or at the Open last year, saying basically that Federer didn't win the match, but that he (Djoko) lost it. And in competition, both aspect are attributes in that you start to get into your opponents' minds that you really are dominant.

Notice that Roger has a whole lot more respect for Djoko then he did last year at this time. And I do think Djoko has a legitimate chance to surpass Roger in majors over the next 10 years b/c he is a phenomenal player, doesn't have a weakness the way Fed has in sometimes getting sloppy or error-prone, Djoko is still growing into his body and his game (he's going to be a better player in the next few years and I don't think you can say that about Fed or Nadal), and he is driven and plays well on each surface. Finally, his competition does not look like it will be too stiff. Nadal looks like he could be breaking down and guys like Murray, Gasquet and Berdych have actually taken step backs this year. So who is going to contend with Djoko for Slams in the next 5-8 years? An aging Fed, a injury-prone Nadal, Roddick (maybe on a hard court once in a while), Donald Young, Sam Querrey, the next big Aussie star, who's up-and-coming in Europe or S. America? No one that I know of.

Djoko is one of those rare players, like Sampras who would lose to Agassi often in Masters Series Events, but when it came time to play a big final in a Slam, almost always beat Agassi, who will lose matches and won't completely dominate tennis, but he will rack up the Slams and he will last b/c he won't kill himself gutting out matches every week. 

This issue is picking up steam and that's good for tennis. I agree with Redhead, it's uncanny and overlooked that Djokovic is more successful and more advanced in his achievements at 20 then Roger was at the same age. This is a phenomenal credit to Djokovic, and one that portends of a GREAT future. Anything is possible with Djokovic if he keeps improving, maturing and getting stronger and smarter, and stays focused on his love for tennis. Anything is possible.

When Federer lost in three sets to Horna at the French Open I doubt anyone was speculating Roger would overtake Pete's record. But look what happened. Like Federer, Djokovic has exhibited flashes of brilliance which excite us for his future. Djokovic's potential is very bright, the sky could be the limit.

I actually agree Djokovic is an uncanny competitor. Right after almost everyone wrote him off as a quitter and a tanker he comes back and wins the veyr next Masters Series event. When people are down on him he comes back with astonishing tennis. ANd he also does it in matches too, when he's playing at his best, when he's in trouble or under stress, he has the uncanny ability to step up and raise his game. He is an extremely dangerous competitor who has baffled Roger on many occasions and will on many more. Even Roger credited Djokovic in the interview he did with Bill Simons, saying Djokovic is a "future great player." Roger can sense the best is yet to come for Djokovic.

The imitations are fantastic. He injects fun  and laughs to tennis. How can people not appreciate that quality? He actually can bring down the house with his imitations but when it's time to take care of business on the court, he is a Serbian assassin. What happened in Monte Carlo was unfortunate but many a great player have done what he did. And last year at Wimbledon, wasn't he exhausted from the long matches and rain? French Open vs. Nadal he was exhausted too, if I remember correctly.

Djokovic and Nadal and Federer will continue to bring out the best tennis in each other and that's great for the sport and all of us who follow it and love it. May the best man win.  

---

:

It's  too  bsd there are sourpusses who don't like  the immitations. The crowds love  them and they are hilarious. If a multimillionaire player can not take a little joking there is something wrong.  If he were picking on the fans that  would  be one  thing but he is having fun with  his peers. They  should  lighten  up  and  chill  out. 

Redhead - thanks for the kind words about me ; - }

 

RP said just almost everything I would have said.   First off, what a bold prediction of yours to say last year that with 0 Grand Slam titles to his credit, Novak Djokovic would exceed the total # eventually won by Roger. Gawd I hope Rog doesn't win 20 Slams....Novak will be grandpa before he would get to 21!  ; - }}

 

So while NO, Djokovic has NOT surpassed Roger, either in the computer rankings or in career Slam titles, yes it's true, Djokovic is leading in the ATP Race. And it's always interesting when folks want to tout FUTURE potential, and claim that a guy or girl is so GREAT at age (fill in the blank, but under 21) it automatically means look how much they'll eventually win.   Apart from Sampras and Graf (who both won Slams as teens and into the old age of nearly/over 30) and have won more majors than any player in Open era history....no other teen phenoms have wound up at the top of the heap for Slam titles won (Borg is a close second). The list of woulda, couldas, shouldas is pretty long...Austin, Chang, Hingis, Majoli, Rios (forgot, he never won one), Capriati.  Djokovic is off to a good start...but he has an oh so long way to go!!!

 

Let me repeat, lest ye forget: UNEASY LIES THE HEAD THAT WEARS THE CROWN!  If Djoko ever gets to #1 and is defending champ at a major, let's see how often he wins/ defends his titles. Roger has successfully defended at every major he's won- Wimbledon and US together 4 years running! What happened this year when Djoko, off an IW win, was defending champ in Miami? Kevin Anderwho?

 

Djoko is an uncanny competitor? I guess that's what they're calling it these days (me, I call it shoddy competitor). He may not let defeat get him down...cause he too easily throws in the towel when he doesn't feel like it.

 

And Redhead, I got an oh so good laugh at the Djoko-Sampras comparison. (Sampras who said Novak is a personality...'if you wanna call it personality'). So Djoko loses often to (Fed/Nadal) like Sampras used to lose to Agassi in Masters series...yet Pete would often beat Andre in Slam big finals?!? First, true Sampars got the better of Agassi in head-to-head and finals.  But Djoko is NO WHERE CLOSE to Sampras, cause Djoko's only won 1 major!  You can't possibly claim they are similar at all!  It's also true Djoko won't kill himself gutting out matches every week....why should he when he can just bail and say he has a tummy ache/sore threat/inuryof the week excuse.  I mean THAT is what you want to see in an "uncanny competitor", isn't it ?!

 

No, I am not a fan of Djoko. Doesn't mean I don't think he isn't playing the best of anyone thus far in 2008. But like I said before, it ain't how you start out, it's where you finish that matters. Novak may win another major this year. And one next year. And some may love his "personality". I have no problems with that. His emergence has certainly created intrigue and excitement for the men's game, with no longer an absolute dominance of one guy, with resistance from another guy on one surface.  The rest of 2008 looks promising.

 

But please let's throw away the Federer tennis obituary, and hold off on the eternal coronation of Djokovic!

Redhead writes "Djoko does not let defeats get him down and he also tries not to let his opponent feel like he has the upper hand on him, albeit by defaulting or at the Open last year, saying basically that Federer didn't win the match, but that he (Djoko) lost it. And in competition, both aspect are attributes in that you start to get into your opponents' minds that you really are dominant...."

   Interesting concept. Unless I am misunderstanding you are basically arguing that tanking or quitting matches is actually a form of intimidation because you can say to an opponent  "I didn't really lose to you, I just quit."

   Sorry, I don't buy that logic.

 If anything I think it works against him because the top guys see "even if I'm not playing well if I just keep Djoker out on the court he might retire with a head cold, sniffles, upset stomach, strained toenail, mild toothache, oncoming allergies, pulled eyelash, blisters from carrying his copies of Break Point, etc. etc...."

   As I said: the guy is a tremendous talent, he can win on every surface and I agree he will win multiple majors and get to #1, but until he finishes major matches on a consistent basis he has not earned the label "uncanny competitor" - he has earned the title "gamesmanship master", but uncanny competitor? Competitor means just that: you compete and find a way to win or at least remain competitive even when you're not feeling well not bail out with a runny nose or bounce the ball two dozen times to buy time between points. But he is young and hopefully he will mature because there is no question he has the game and ability but remains prone to pulling out which is not good for him, for his competitive character or for tennis. It reinforces the stereotype that tennis players are soft when this guy casually quits in majors and Masters Series events citing lame excuses.

I wouldn't call what Djoko does a form of intimidation, I'd say it's a very effective mind game and it's worked on the former best player in the world, Federer. At the Open last year, Djoko had that match on his racket, and he wasn't afraid to say as much in the presser afterwards. Even his mother came out and said that the next time her son played Fed in a big match, Novak would win. And she was prescient b/c anyone who saw the Djoko-Fed semis at the Aussie O can not deny that he djoko gave fed what we call on the courts, a real nose smack. And then he stalled a red hot Tsonga in the finals after the Frenchman won the first set and had everyone whupping it up in the stands.

What Djoko has is an uncanny ability to turn the tides of a match that is going in the wrong direction. He did that against Fish at Hopmans at the beginning of the year. And yes, you can call his style of competition onto the judge's seat, but think of the best competitor in the NBA today, Kobe Bryant, didn't he refuse to take a shot last year in the playoffs when people were criticizing him for shooting too much? But you can't say Kobe doesn't have the eye of the tiger.

The clay belongs to Nadal, it remains to be seen if either Nadal, Djoko or Roddick can dethrone Roger on the grass, I think one of them has a good chance this year, but the hard courts, the two majors on that surface, belong to Djoko, and he will win 7 out of the next ten Slams in five years time on that surface, and 3 to 5 of the other Slams in that time period, giving him 10-12 Slams by the time he's Fed's age now.  

You write: " I'd say it's a very effective mind game and it's worked on the former best player in the world, Federer...."

 Really? Last time I checked Djoker checked out of his last match with Federer without even completing the match. So he loses the match yet wins the mind game battle? If you really believe that one then you're playing mind games with yourself.

Sure, he beat Fed in Australia, but they've played 8 times and Federer has won 6 of those 8 matches. Now obviously Djoker is younger and going to get better and better but please let's not rewrite history: you're basing your point on 1 match a match when Federer clearly wasnt' right. That's not to say Djoker won't beat him at full strength, but he's only beaten Federer twice, he's got one major to his credit and you're already crowning him as the player who will win more majors then Fed? Then again, why am I surprised? You've been steadfast in claiming Spadea is better than Blake so results don't seem to matter much.

As for Roddick on grass, don't forget: Roddick beat Djoker on hard court (his favorite surface) in Dubai. If they played on grass tomorrow, I would favor Roddick over Djoker on grass right now.

Redhead must be positioning himself to write a book on the Djoker.Seems like you can get the old Spadea threads and just replace Spadea's name with Djokers

 

To the poster who keeps saying "uneasy lies the head that wears the crown." Nole's been the #1 player on the ATP race and he's been wearing the crown as the best player of 2008 proudly all year long. You need to find some other lame quote to repeat over and over because that one no longer applies.

Who cares that Nole didn't defend his Miami title. Fed didn't defend his first major title in Hamburg either but just like Nole he didn't let that stop him from winning other major titles.

All the flak Nole is getting for his retirement makes me sick. How do you know that he doesn't have some kind of legitimate illness or respiratory problem that he doesn't want to go public with? Just because he doesn't hold a press confrence to announce that he's sick like some people doesn't mean he's faking it.

And one day one of you Fed fans have to explain to me what the difference is between Fed's losses with mono and Fed without. I've watched his losses before he had mono and he looks like the same lethargic, error-proned, out of sorts on big points as he does when he's supposedly suffering from mono. Case in point his match with Canas last year or his match with Murray in Cincinnati.

Hyacinth - not a Fed fan. Oh Well!

I am that poster who has said: "Uneasy lies the head that wears the crown". And it applies to the #1 ranked player in the world. That is currently ROGER FEDERER!  Yes, Djokovic currently leads the ATP Race. But the race only matters at the end of the year, not the beginning or middle. And the quote definitely applies: Let's talk *when* (if) Djokovic becomes #1, and then is the defending champ at a major or at any other tournament. Let's see how he deals with pressure when every one is gunning for him.  As a point of reference, Roger Federer has already been ranked #1 for more consecutive weeks than any player inn history. Also he's the only player to win Wimbledon-US Open in the same year 4 years running. He's also defended his Australian Open crown. And virtually every tournament he's ever won! Roger has worn the crown of #1 better than almost anyone in history.

 

As to Djokovic, when he was the defending champ at a big event the first time, he lost to Kevin Anderwho in the first round! 

 

Pity poor Nole for his ill health in his matches (oh so many times when he's had to default). And Hyacninth, my sympathies to you too, since you've been sick from all the flak. Had you had to call in sick for work, or bail in the middle, stiffing your fans from the experience of watching you perform?

 

I've never claimed Djokovic was faking anything. But certainly makes you wonder why he has a penchant for chucking in the towel when the going gets rough (and then there are those who call it being an "uncanny competitor".) 

 

 

The race matters, especially after 6 major tournaments have been played because it shows who's the best and  most consistent player up until this point... It's not Roger Federer!

Yes, Fed is the #1 ranked player this year but he's definitely not the best player of the year. That crown belongs to the guy who's been on top of the atp race and that is NOVAK DJOKOVIC.

We don't need to wait on Nole to defend his titles or revisit Federer's past. We're talking about the here and now not the past or the future. There is no indication that Nole is feeling any pressure. He seems content with being a top player and determined to go higher. There is nothing about his performance this year that says uneasy.

I just don't understand why you are dwelling on the fact that he lost to Anderson in Miami. Fed lost early when it came time to defend his first major title in Hamburg. He had bumps in the road before he parked at #1, why would it be any different for Nole? I'm not saying Nole is dominating men's tennis or he's going to have a career like Fed's but he's the best player on tour right now and there's no question about it.

You can save your pity, me and Nole are doing just fine. If you want to feel sorry for someone feel bad for Fed. He's the one that seems to have forgotten how to win a major title or is it Mirka's home cooking that's slowing him down?